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Excess deaths from covid vaccine - where are they?

Covid
#1

I mentioned a couple of days ago that I have been looking at Ivor Cummins’ favourite data source for mortality - euromomo - to get a sense of the excess deaths in highly vaxxed populations. I’m copying the chart for England and Israel at the end of this. If 10s of thousands of people were dying of the vaccinations (rather than what we might expect in terms of deaths for this time of year anyway) we should see a blip in the chart. Personally I see big blips for deaths from Covid during the various waves (in England at least - Israel seems to have handled their - Jewish - citizens better than Bojo handled us), but I don’t see any evidence at all of mass vaccine deaths.

I’ll keep an eye out, of course, for new data or better data as it comes in. But so far, I don’t see anything… Perhaps I’ve misunderstood the data. If so, I’m happy to be corrected, as always.

Cheers
PP

excess deaths uk israel 2021
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#2

What do you reckon about the VAERS/EudraVigilance/Yellow Card figures, P? Credible to any useful degree? And what about this widely spoken caveat, that these are known to be massively under-estimated against the true numbers? What do you think?

#3

Well, as you know, I don’t have the time to analyse the nitty gritty. But here is what looks to me to be some sense injected into the argument. Here are some snippets (and yes, perhaps taken out of context).

“Harsher winter conditions are expected to account for more numbers of hospitalisations and deaths, but not to fundamentally change the characteristics of the resultant disease. Some other factor must have been at work during the vaccine rollout.”

" Up until the vaccine rollout, the reduction in lethality is clearly identifiable in the statistics. So where has all the fear and alarm come from … ? Once again the UK government were reliant upon their preferred experts at Imperial College London (ICL) for their new variant alarm. … ICL said the sub-variant was up to 70% more transmissible. They were wrong again, as usual, but the New and Emerging Respiratory Virus Threats Advisory Group (NERVTAG) used ICL’s “science” to provide some legitimacy to the governments claim that the COVID–19 pandemic was still raging."

More scamdemic data here

#4

PP, do you think that people should be forced to take an experimental gene therapy, still in the trial stage, in order to participate in normal life?

Do you think that children should be injected with this stuff?

Whatever way it’s spun, large numbers of people are dying from these vaccines, and even larger numbers are suffering serious side effects. Why are you so casual about this?

Why do you not acknowledge how totally corrupt big pharma are? (it’s well documented)

#5

Hi RG

I reckon that these systems are crucial to any serious attempt to track and ultimately understand what on earth is going on, but I’m not sure what conclusions can be drawn directly from them. I think they are very likely to be undercounts - any voluntary system would be - and I do think they are credible.

My opinion, for whatever little that’s worth, is that these systems are starting points for investigation and analysis rather than end points from which we can draw conclusions. And I know from hard won hands on experience of complex data analysis, that the is not a simple or quick job. It’ll take time and careful analysis to try and tease out all the confounding variables, investigate the various interactions and finally draw formal casual connections between side effects, deaths and vaccines.

That kind of careful thinking is anathema to click-bait headlines and back of the envelope extrapolations and conclusions and fundamentally incompatible with 99.9% of all media reports on the subject.

More thinking, more investigation, less strident headlines - that’s my current wish.

Cheers
PP

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#6

Hi Rob

I think I agree with most of the points you raised. Certainly I hold no water for big pharma, I’m under no illusions about the level of corruption they embody, and am not convinced the these vaccines were rigourously tested in an honest way. I don’t think that children should be forced to have them, or indeed that anyone should be forced to have them. I believe in public information and open discussion - something very hard to get on this subject.

This is the point that I’ve been trying to understand. Unless these deaths are simply not being recorded at all then there must be a death certificate somewhere. These death certificates ultimately end up in the all-cause mortality stats. Even if the authorities lied about the cause of death (to try and hide vaccine deaths) we should still see a spike in excess mortality indicating the something is causing people to die at a higher rate than we would expect. I just don’t see this in the data that I can find on excess deaths. Unless I’m looking at the wrong thing, the current death rate is perfectly in line with the mortality level for this time of year.

I might be looking at the wrong data, or there may be some reason that vaccine deaths are simply not being recorded at all. Or perhaps my analysis is just plain wrong. But right now I can’t see the signs of 10s of thousands of deaths.

Cheers
PP

#7

A question to bear in mind is: how many deaths would you need in order to be able to detect them from a graph? Thousands? It’s a pretty crude measurement and perhaps the numbers are too low to be noticeable (at the moment). Murders are not noticeable. Yet, that certainly doesn’t mean they’re in any way acceptable! (Not that you’re saying this I should add).

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#8

You haven’t really answered any of the questions I’ve raised.

For instance, who are the people who want to inject children with this crap?

Why are you so passive against these psychos? and instead want to put up endless idiotic graphs.

People are dying from these vaccines, and they are now coming for our children.

I know people are a bit kranky at the moment, but it really is time to make a stand.

No more of this shite.

You can stick your graphs and stats up where the sun don’t shine.

#9

I’ve no idea of the efficacy of this…

The problem, of course, is that no debate is allowed.

You know that a society is in real trouble when debate is completely shut down.

#10

Hi @PontiusPrimate. I’ll have another attempt because I think this 28 day comparison is important, loads of folk have long asked for it.

Would I be right in thinking that his seems to describe your main issue:

" Even if the authorities lied about the cause of death (to try and hide vaccine deaths) we should still see a spike in excess mortality indicating the something is causing people to die at a higher rate than we would expect. I just don’t see this in the data that I can find on excess deaths. Unless I’m looking at the wrong thing, the current death rate is perfectly in line with the mortality level for this time of year."

Aren’t you looking at a spike in excess deaths on your England graph, during the period of the vaccine rollout?

We already know a significant number of the ‘covid deaths’ that are claimed to make up this spike are not due to covid.
From the various treatment graphs (unfortunately the only ones that show the five-year averages plotted alongside excess covid-related deaths) I’d estimate a third to half of the ‘covid deaths’ (in yellow) can not be covid or covid related. As I’ve said more than once, this is because if there were no pandemic then when covid deaths were removed the graphs would show big reductions in deaths for no reason.

I posted one on the other thread, here’s another one (most of the treatments show similar patterns):

image
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https://app.powerbi.com/view?r=eyJrIjoiYmUwNmFhMjYtNGZhYS00NDk2LWFlMTAtOTg0OGNhNmFiNGM0IiwidCI6ImVlNGUxNDk5LTRhMzUtNGIyZS1hZDQ3LTVmM2NmOWRlODY2NiIsImMiOjh9

All those yellows above the five-year average are fair game for lurking vaccine excess deaths, and at just the right time too.

You mention the current death rate but we are in the second year of covid so the effect of the previous year needs to be considered.
The five-year mortality at this time of year - since March, as that is when numbers rose in 2020 - is greatly boosted by last year’s covid deaths.

From March this year, the graphs show excess deaths not ‘perfectly in line’ with this time of year as you say - but rather, if you look closely, they are clearly below this inflated normal.

That must explain why the spike in excess deaths comes down in March, and even goes negative after that.

I’d guess the large number of deaths in March-June last year, even when divided by five, would push the excess deaths recorded to below zero, with enough room to spare to mask the vaccine deaths. (It doesn’t do this ‘pushing’ on its own - covid deaths came down as well.)

I understand about not jumping in, but I think you might be over complicating the issue here. Anyway, here’s another way to look at it that is not subjective:

Assuming you aren’t casting doubt on the Scottish data, are the extra deaths following the vaccine not simply a fact? If so, the excess deaths data isn’t the place to look for an explanation. Even if you can’t see them, they must be there somewhere! Absorbed by the murky complexity perhaps, but they can’t be gone.

Cheers

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Covid-19: England sees biggest fall in life expectancy since records began
Vaccine excess deaths pg.94
#11

Charming. Let’s try and keep the discussion civil, eh? How about that for a radical idea? Ignoring the actual data doesn’t seem like a good way to get to the underlying truth of the matter. But as Rhis has said, I guess we all have our own way to process information.

Incidentally I’m pretty sure I did answer the questions you raised. As for your new question, there are groups who believe that is important to vaccinate children (over 12) but I don’t think they are in the majority. Not in this country certainly.

Cheers
PP

5 Likes
#12

Thanks @Evvy_dense

I’m not ignoring your posts - actually the opposite. The fact is that your detailed posts always make me stop and think about what you’re saying. That’s why I’m taking a little longer to respond. Let me look at what you’ve said and get back to you.

Cheers
PP

Covid-19: England sees biggest fall in life expectancy since records began
#13

I should maybe have held off awhile, thought you might be pondering - thanks for the interim response!
There’s no rush - it’s a good chance for me to read up about bias in the science of variations in cycle-helmet hesitancy in urban and rural locations :slight_smile:

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#14

What concerns me more, to be honest, is that while it’s entirely good and proper to try and make sense of the data, and I will try to keep on doing so, in the meantime the headlong rush toward totalitarianism has advanced by a dozen steps.

The music will be stopping quite soon and there are way fewer chairs than we thought they were going to be.

EDIT: this isn’t specifically a reply to ED more of a general howl in the dark :sob:

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#15

Hi Karen

Yes, I agree. And let’s not forget that the vaccines were totally unnecessary if Ivermectin works as well as it seems to. My feeling is that the push towards totalitarianism was always the aim, and covid was the shock that allowed the PTB to accelerate that agenda. This feels to me like the march to feudalism in the form of the great reset.

On the subject of understanding the deaths from vaccines etc. we should remember that as of this moment only a minority of the world pop has had these jabs. If there is clear indication of mass fatalities then it’s important to get that info out before the rest of the world gets them. It would be ironic in the extreme if this time the medical guinea pigs were affluent Americans and Europeans, and the ones who were spared were poor people in sub Saharan Africa!

Cheers
PP

2 Likes
#16

Yes I’m sure we’re spending too much time verifying the number of deck chairs on the good ship Titanic. This week compulsory vaccinations began, starting with the low-hanging fruit (very busy places) but every indication the govt doesn’t want to stop there.
BJ chose the ironically dubbed ‘freedom day’ as the most politic, but there was also a rush before falling virus numbers diminish the public’s propagandised baying tolerance for it.

PP: “This feels to me like the march to feudalism in the form of the great reset.”

Yes I think most of us here would agre. It’s also backed up by government actions and stealth. Even while the govt were saying ‘there are no plans for vaccine passorts’, contracts for implementation of ‘vaccine passports’ were signed going back to February and even December (Flak chuckers claim that December one was only for ‘covid status certification’).

Rights groups like Big Brother Watch are up in arms. Have a look at this.

You get a hilarious woman as a bonus (Juliet Hartley-Brewer)
She gets people on her show and doesn’t let them get much of a word in, as she tells them how it is at 100 mph - like a Jonathan Pie with guests. And that’s when she agrees with them!
But the guest from Big Brother Watch was alert to her brief opportunities for camera time and came in to articulate how bad it was, and how the government lied.

EDIT: apparently 43 Tory MPs have signed up to Big Brother Watch and their campaign opposing vaccine passports. Saw that here, about 50s in

The LibDems have moved over into opposition, along with Keir Starmer. The GBNews reporter on the link notes that one rebel MP said he thought the govt would lose a vote on the issue if it were now.
I think there won’t be a vote until September.
The knife-edge Commons situation may also have played a part in Johnson’s announcement on nightclubs etc; he may be trying to nudge the landscape over the summer

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#17

This is the first reply I have seen on this site that is out of order, in my opinion.
I share your rage as I have children and grand children who need to be protected from the Shits in Charge. But we don’t do that by turning on posters who are clearly only trying to navigate this nightmare in the way they feel best able.
If we disagree then we can argue the points - while we are allowed to by Big Brother!

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#18

It would. But then again multiple sceptical or is it hesitant politicians in Africa have been offed, allegedly. The Malagasy president almost became the latest example.

Could this be connected to the untested covid-Organics herbal tea developed by Madagascar Institute of Applied Research?

It was popular in Tanzania. For a while.

Not so long ago Squirrel was at the G7 getting the instructions needed to make sure that South Africa acts as the fulcrum for African compliance.

This is full-pelt now. The global economic collapse can’t be more than months away.

Correction: it already happened. The ending of palliative care can’t be more than months away.

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#19

Sorry I know the thread has moved on somewhat!
Howl in the dark - well said. We need to be aware of the tide lapping on our feet.
PP also has a point that there will likely be a long term information war as well. Points of contention have a habit of reappearing.

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#20

Rob this is obviously a breach of our guidelines and ethos. You can question or reject other posters’ viewpoints and priorities but there isn’t any need to attack them personally.

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