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Of statins and statistics

“Your risk score is above 10%, which is why we would like you to discuss starting statin medication if you are interested.”

It said this in two successive “results sheets” received after two Annual Health Checks I attended. One in August, late-August at that, the second one in the first half of December.

At the first Nurse H explained that when a new patient, which I was, joins the practice, which I had. Is aged over sixty, which I am, they are offered a Health Check as a way of gathering your history. So don’t pay much attention to the letter. But I did.

In between that Annual Health Check and my next, this time the Real Annual Health Check, early December, remember? I’d been prescribed Blood Pressure meds. Having taken daily readings on a cheap Chinese BP meter I could see a scarily high score quite quickly becoming less alarming. Pretty soon I’m on the double dose, less impact funnily.

So the second set of “results sheets” includes a freakily low, for me, BP reading.

There’s this section that reads “target score 10% or lower” and a result saying 16.54%. Previously it was 13.93%

Now comes this suggestion of statins and my question is: have vague memories of hearing bad things about statins. Any leads? I’ve not yet read the NHS version of iNfoRmAtiOn.

Secondary question, but I think I know this one. Do you think I’m being led down a particular path by some algorithm?

All thoughts very very welcome, this is my sad life we’ve talking here :slight_smile:

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I believe the latest reports indicate that there is no evidence that statins help anyone. There are known side-effects I can’t recall them now - I gave them up years ago as I did with blood pressure tablets and went onto natural herbal remedies like hawthorn.

The NHS tests for anything and the more they test the more they say they find, but despite the pills I believe the numbers of people with problems continues to rise. Of course the numbers will have been massively affected by the jab, imo.

cheers

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I wouldn’t go near a medical professional now, regardless. Final straw was a broken foot a few years ago. The medical experience we enjoyed in our youth and younger is long gone. I put them on par with mechanics and most of them (my personal experience) are crap.

I’m sure I’ve read somewhere that they are not good for you.

Is dodgy blood pressure a family thing? If it isn’t, then I’d look at my personal life and what can be done to make it easier (I know, right). You’ve been through a lot. Divorce, new house, far from old friends etc. I’m sure there’s stress loitering from that. Then of course there is the stress of having the knowledge and not being blissfully unaware.

Stay safe.

Edit for link

https://www.naturalnews.com/2024-08-27-statin-drug-industry-profits-from-lies-about-cholesterol.html

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My two cents worth is this.

Statins are one of the greatest big pharma scams second only to convid. It’s all related to is high cholesterol bad. There are so many points of view on this but all the sensible views agree that the basis of LDL to HDL (the ‘good’ and ‘bad’ cholesterol) ratio. Almost every dietitian without an axe to grind agrees that this is not the basis for deciding you have a problem at all.

When I’m back in France I’ll copy you with a scan from a very good book which explains a lot of this. I know you don’t like video but try some of those on Rumble.

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And right on time ….

“ The findings suggest that adjusting your gut flora may be a simple way to naturally maintain optimized cholesterol levels.”

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Dr. Malcolm Kendrick has written extensively on this business “The Great Cholesterol Con ” (2008), “Doctoring Data ” (2015), “A Statin Nation: Damaging Millions in a Brave New Post-Health World ” (2018) and “The Clot Thickens: The enduring mystery of heart disease ” (2021).

He and Dr Zoë Harcombe have just won a long court case against the Daily Mail which tried to trash their reputations on this very issue in March 2019. Chapters & many verses here:

Our advice: don’t go near statins, don’t go near medical ‘tests’ - for any damned thing at all - , don’t go near GPs or their drug dens, not ever again, ever.

And have a very merry Christmas, eat & drink owt you want & plenty of it but not sugar, sugar substitutes, carbohydrates, green veg, anything commercially processed (well, red wine, single malts & calvados excepted of course)!

(We’re in our seventies, enjoying life and detoxing nicely, as & when, in our own time.)

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But is there a more subtle thing being played out?

Appreciate the feedback.

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Brilliant, thank you.

You are so 100% over the target (sorry) pointing out that being thrown into a measure, then adjust, funk was painful, and probably better not to know.

I’ll definitely shirk the next Annual Health Check. No real quarrel with an MOT but yearly is plenty.

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I am much more relaxed about videos these days. And generally. I prefer YouTube mainly for ease of use but all and any links will be followed up.

Thanks!

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Thank you so much. Will follow this up along with the other links.

A merry season of Saturnalia to you too. I will confess I’m gorging on a macaroon from evil Azduh right now. Sugar is a harsh mistress.

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Some suggestions;

Get an O/S map for your area. Explore.

The above should involve walking. Some swimming would be good too (but it ain’t cheap nowadays. Cold too…).

Remember any dreams from childhood? As Oasis sang, they fade away as we’re living. Remember any? Maybe now is the time to indulge.

Learn a new practical skill. They said learn to code. I’d say learn to weld.

Take a mooch around you new home and look for easy cheap DIY projects. Gap filing. Draught excluders. Unassembled door canopies are about £35. Putting it together will keep you occupied.

Lastly, from personal experience, seems making friends isn’t as easy as it used to be. Look for clubs. Familiar subject or something new, you’ll be forced to interact. Works for me.

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Hi Kieran-Telo :slightly_smiling_face:

I think the subject of statins is one where it’s hard to gauge the politics-free truth. Everything they say about the medical politics behind statins is plausible, likely even; a dynamic driven by profit and control that has existed and prevailed for decades.
Trying to be objective, my impression is that the bulk of the entrenched cholesterol view has met a strong challenge by the hypotheses of Kendrick and others. Without the underlying medical knowledge, my gut would still ‘vote’ for them being right.

The respectable and respected (IMO) A Midwestern Doctor runs through the politics etc

The one thing I would say is that among those medics with a bit more faith, but not necessarily a lot, there seems to be agreement that the strongest evidence for statins is for those who have had a heart attack, for preventing more heart attacks - ie secondary prevention.
AMW in the above article doesn’t cover this aspect; I presume this is due to secondary prevention only accounting for a small proportion of statin prescriptions.

One study less likely to be powered by pharma money (due to the presence of Peter McCullough in the lineup, and after covid too) is this one, in which this view on secondary prevention is stressed:

Usefulness of Statins as Secondary Prevention Against Recurrent and Terminal Major Adverse Cardiovascular Events
“Statins are not only indicated, but also confer the greatest benefit for secondary prevention. 12,24”
https://www.ajconline.org/action/showPdf?pii=S0002-9149(22)00430-1

If it was me and I’d had a heart attack, I’d feel I was in a bit of a dilemma, certainly I’d look into alternatives, and might (or might not) take the darned things while I was looking, and stop if there were any worrying side effects.

There are other more natural ways to lower cholesterol. But is it all about cholesterol? (More to add to what has been posted on this…)

OTOH (my handwringing continues), statins seem to do other useful things. They have an unheralded anti-inflammatory effect, and a school of thought says this is useful in cancer treatment. This anti-inflammatory effect may help prevent a second heart attack in ways other than reducing cholesterol.
This development would undoubtedly be serendipitous for the statins industry, which launched them almost blindly once they realised they could lower cholesterol, and with far less knowledge of the wider picture than there is now.

I might ask the docs what medical parameters they think put me (you) at risk and what were your figures, and get those tested again in say 6m or a year’s time. Certainly attend to any of the obvious non-pharma things that may apply to you eg things like weight, exercise, diet, which are win-wins on the cardio front. They will likely reduce your cholesterol anyway, incidental though it may be.

If I’d had no heart attack I’d do the same kinds of things, but I’d go along with the choir and tend to treat the statins advice as unreliable due to its history and objectively weaker evidence, as enough medics are questioning it. And file along with other over-zealous medical promotions cascaded down by profiteers that are worth checking, just not right now. But I’d heed the warning nevertheless and take a look round with a prophylactic view, as you are doing.

Medics who argues against statins usually say that if you take statins, you should should also take co-enzyme Q10.

The main side effect and criticism of statins is myopathy.

It seems generally accepted that statins reduce co-enzyme Q10, and that these levels return on supplementation. Whether the supplementation benefits as much as intended is trickier. Some individual trials have found so, systematic reviews less so.

This one did find benefit
Effects of Coenzyme Q10 on Statin-Induced Myopathy: An Updated Meta-Analysis of Randomized Controlled Trials

IMO, systematic reviews and meta-analyses can be rather blunt instruments and are biased towards randomized controlled trials (which tend to be pharma sponsored due to their size) even when these are deficient in key respects. Despite having ‘bias checks’ they seem powerless to detect blindinginly obvious bias in authors’ decisions, interpretations and language. So many studies mis-state their results, abandon very basic rules of hypothesis testing yet come up as bias free in automatic ‘tests’.

As noted, statin dissidents say that for those taking statins, supplementing Co-Q10 is essential and I’d side with them on that one, no harms have been demonstrated; so alleviating a real concern associated with the drugs seems to make sense.
Particularly as Co-Q10 seems intrinsically involved in key metabolic functions and other cardio stuff.

Eg
Coenzyme Q10 for heart failure

I’ve been re-reading a couple of summary articles presenting the emerging picture as related by informed opposition, will post them soon. For now I’m off to consume some cholesterol, and some far worse things…

Hope helpful.

ED

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Hi again Kieran-Telo

Two articles I’d seen which had a decent level of detail. They are both from the Epoch Times.

The first highlights the problem of insulin resistance caused by statins and makes a case for niacin (vitamin B3) instead which may have the pluses without the minuses. I’m not sure if the situation of secondary prevention has been considered separately though.

The second puts forward 3 natural products from a cardio viewpoint, as told by alternative/natural practitioners. According to whom (if I’ve read it right that is; the take home message is…stay at home and read it. Please don’t rely on my attempts to pot it! :slightly_smiling_face:) inflammation rather than LDL cholesterol is in the van as the pathway to heart attacks.
The three products already have pedigree in cardiovascular-related areas away from the pharma world; nattokinase is advocated by FLCCC as one of the first lines for long covid/long vaccine which overlaps with clotting etc. (I’m not medical so neither are my overlaps). Berberine has ancient history in TCM, and has a growing shout among cancer researchers, and of course patients. I don’t know anything about bergamot except the claims made here.
ED

Statins: The Lesser-Known Dangers, and a Good Alternative

By Vance Voetberg

8/12/2023Updated: 10/21/2024

0:00

For decades, statins—the most common cholesterol-lowering medications—have been recognized as a lifesaver for those with heart disease. Although statins have positively revolutionized heart health, some studies highlight the lesser-known concerns of the medication: energy-sapping, increased diabetes risk, and, for many people, muscle pain.

Puzzling Link Between Statins, Insulin Resistance

A recent systematic review of 11 epidemiological studies with nearly 47 million participants found associations between statin use and decreased insulin sensitivity, and increased insulin resistance—both significant factors for developing Type 2 diabetes. Additionally, statins were found to reduce glycemic control and elevate fasting glucose levels.

Experts are uncertain about the precise mechanism through which statins might affect insulin resistance, considering their advantages, such as lowering inflammation, decreasing oxidative stress, and enhancing endothelial function—all of which improve insulin sensitivity rather than diminish it.

A 2021 study published in the journal Arteriosclerosis, Thrombosis, and Vascular Biology also found that statins can increase the risk of Type 2 diabetes, but how was unclear. Despite the risks, most researchers and health care professionals still believe statins are more beneficial than harmful.

“It is generally viewed that the strengths of lower cholesterol by a lot outweigh a modest increase in insulin resistance,” Michael Snyder, a genetics professor and chair of the Genetics Department at Stanford University School of Medicine, told The Epoch Times.

But the double-sided nature of statins remains unclear to researchers, according to Dr. Snyder, who has coauthored multiple studies investigating the correlation between statin usage and insulin intolerance.

Lifestyle factors such as obesity also play a major role in insulin resistance, and people can reduce body weight to potentially offset statins’ effects, Dr. Snyder said.

Why Do Statins Drain Energy?

Fatigue and muscle pain seem to be common with statin use. A study of more than 350 statin users found that 93 percent reported muscle pain and fatigue, while 85 percent reported weakness.

Cardiologist Speaks Truth About Cholesterol and Statins

6/28/2023

Just Say No to Statins

5/29/2023

“This is of no surprise because of the well-documented effects that statins have on coenzyme Q-10 (CoQ10), which is a primary cofactor for mitochondrial function,” Dr. Node Smith, a board-certified naturopathic physician, told The Epoch Times. Mitochondria create energy for the entire body at the cellular level. Therefore, statins can deplete the body’s cellular energy by depleting CoQ10, he added.

A letter to the editor published in the British Journal of Clinical Pharmacology noted that people taking statins who also supplemented with CoQ10 were less likely to experience chronic fatigue.

Dr. Smith said many of his patients who have taken statins long-term have reported experiencing persistent muscle pain, weakness, fatigue, and brain fog.

“Some of these patients are avid athletes and simply are confused why they can no longer work out,” he added.

“If I see this presentation in someone on a statin medication, I will almost always assume the statin is at least a contributing factor and discuss with the patient its removal and replacement with another therapy.”

Vitamin B3 a Potential Alternative

Statins are commonly used alongside niacin (vitamin B3), which has been recommended for more than 40 years to prevent heart disease because of its positive effect on lipid levels.

Niacin is the most common and effective treatment that replaces statins, according to Dr. Smith.

“Of all the pharmaceutical medications I’ve helped people get off of, statins are the easiest, least concerning, and patients typically have the best results with—because it is not uncommon for them to feel almost instantly better.”

Niacin decreases LDL cholesterol, which can build up plaque in arteries when levels are too high. It also increases HDL cholesterol, which absorbs other forms of cholesterol in the bloodstream and carries it back to the liver for removal, according to a clinical trial of more than 300 people. Additionally, niacin lowers triglycerides, a type of fat in the blood.

Optimized niacin therapy costs patients $15 to $30 per month and is worth trying before statins, Dr. Smith said.

Studies have found that combining niacin and statins may outperform statins alone. Dr. Smith has observed similar results in his practice, although some studies suggest otherwise.

Niacin fell out of favor because of the side effect of niacin flushing, which produces a slight prickly heat sensation for about 30 minutes and can be uncomfortable and concerning for some people, he said.

About 15 years ago, wax-coated niacin tablets were developed. They allow high doses of niacin to be delivered while reducing flushing for most people, according to Dr. Smith. Side-effect management methods such as taking niacin with food or baking soda can also help.

However, Dr. Smith cautioned that people with familial hypercholesterolemia, a genetic disorder, may need more aggressive therapies, potentially including statins.

Vance Voetberg

Author

3 Alternatives to Statins Might Target the Root of Heart Disease

Mar 12, 2024

(The second article)
3 Alternatives to Statins Might Target the Root of Heart Disease

Explore the potential of natural supplements as alternatives or complements to statins for heart health.

Berberine supplement capsules. Anna Hoychuk/Shutterstock

By Vance Voetberg

3/12/2024Updated: 7/27/2024

0:00

Statins have been the go-to treatment for preventing heart disease, the leading cause of death worldwide, for decades. But they may not be the cure-all they’ve been made out to be.

These cholesterol-lowering drugs fail to address what experts say is one of the key root causes of cardiovascular issues: inflammation from oxidized blood lipids.

Mounting research indicates that natural supplements such as berberine, nattokinase, and bergamot are nutraceuticals with effects that may succeed where statins fall short.

Understanding the Root of the Problem

Oxidized blood lipids refer to fats in the bloodstream that have undergone oxidation, a process in which molecules lose electrons. Low-density lipoprotein (LDL) cholesterol, commonly known as “bad” cholesterol, can become oxidized because of various factors, including smoking, high blood pressure, diabetes, and high levels of other reactive substances in the body.

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When LDL cholesterol is oxidized, it can contribute to plaque formation in the arteries. This plaque can narrow the arteries and restrict blood flow, leading to atherosclerosis, which is the thickening or hardening of the arteries and can increase the risk of heart disease and stroke. The nutraceuticals described below can help, but it’s important to know that none of these can replace a healthy lifestyle or negate harmful habits, such as smoking, that can cause disease.

The Chinese Super Berry: Berberine

Berberine has been used in traditional Chinese medicine for thousands of years. Primarily found in the Chinese barberry plant, berberine is a plant compound that boasts multifaceted benefits ranging from enhanced cognitive function to controlled blood glucose levels to fortifying the immune system.

“There’s a lot of quality data on berberine and a good safety profile,” Dr. Jack Wolfson, a board-certified cardiologist, said.

Berberine is a compound that can be found in barberry plants. amtiko/Shutterstock

Cardio Benefits

A recent meta-analysis of 44 studies found that berberine improved blood lipids, inflammation, and atherosclerosis with minimal risks. It also outperformed statins in reducing factors such as stroke risk and artery plaque buildup.

Anti-Diabetic Benefits

One-third of people with Type 2 diabetes also have cardiovascular disease, according to a review published in Cardiovascular Diabetology. The two metabolic diseases are often interconnected. People with diabetes have a doubled risk of developing heart disease or experiencing a stroke in comparison to those without diabetes.

Related Stories

Statins: The Lesser-Known Dangers, and a Good Alternative

8/12/2023

Cardiologist Speaks Truth About Cholesterol and Statins

6/28/2023

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Emerging research also highlights berberine’s anti-diabetic potential. Studies show it may lower blood glucose, triglycerides, and insulin. One 2009 paper called it the “ideal medicine” for treating Type 2 diabetes, and a 2023 report found that berberine outperformed metformin, a drug that lowers blood glucose levels, in treating obesity and controlling blood lipids.

“If someone needs both lipids and glucose lowered, berberine is my first go-to,” Angela Sadlon, a licensed naturopathic physician, told The Epoch Times. But high doses may cause cramping or loose stools, she noted, adding that working with a holistic doctor can prevent side effects.

The Japanese Superfood: Natto

Natto is a traditional fermented soybean dish widely consumed throughout Japan for thousands of years. Nattokinase, an enzyme from the fermented soy food natto, has been researched for its potential cardiovascular benefits.

“Nattokinase is an enzyme that breaks down unwanted blood clots in the blood circulation,” Gitte Jensen, research director at NIS Labs, a contract research laboratory, told The Epoch Times. Nattokinase can break down problematic blood clots by “digesting” fibrin, a protein that plays a central role in blood clotting.

“Fibrin is a molecule that is only wanted when we have a wound and we need to repair the wound,” Ms. Jensen said. However, when the body is inflamed, clumps of fibrin can form, contributing to atherosclerosis, she said.

Natto is a traditional fermented soybean dish widely consumed throughout Japan for thousands of years. beauty-box/Shutterstock

Studies since the 1980s have explored whether nattokinase supplements could help prevent cardiovascular events and strokes.

While some studies found nattokinase didn’t provide meaningful cardiovascular protection, more recent research found higher-dose nattokinase improved biomarkers in people with atherosclerosis and high blood lipids.

One 2022 study published in Frontiers in Cardiovascular Medicine found that supplementing nattokinase for a year effectively managed atherosclerosis and high lipid levels. Another study showed nattokinase reduced plaque buildup by 36.6 percent compared to 11.5 percent for statins.

Nattokinase prevents plaque buildup, a leading cause of heart attacks and strokes, according to Dr. David Brownstein, a board-certified family physician. Statins are often ineffective for this, he said.

A Mediterranean Moment: Bergamot

Grown mainly along the coast of Italy, bergamot is a lime-like citrus fruit that Italians have prized for centuries. Its medicinal use as an anti-infectious agent dates back to at least 1688. This century, bergamot has shown promise for managing blood lipids and promoting heart health.

Researchers attribute these potential heart-protective effects to bergamot’s anti-inflammatory properties.

Bergamot is a lime-like citrus fruit that Italians have prized for centuries. ISEN STOCKER/Shutterstock

One study on 80 people with high cholesterol found that six months of bergamot supplementation significantly lowered levels of small, dense LDL particles—the type most prone to oxidation.

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Bergamot can effectively reduce triglycerides and total LDL cholesterol, a 2019 systematic review published in Food Science and Nutrition concluded. However, the authors noted that research on bergamot is still limited and that more studies are needed to determine its efficacy and optimal dosing fully.

The Complete Solution

While the above foods and supplements can help, true reversal of heart disease requires comprehensive changes, Dr. Wolfson told The Epoch Times. Eating a wholesome diet and avoiding inflammatory foods is essential, he said.

While nutraceuticals may help lower biomarkers for heart disease, they don’t address the root lifestyle causes that lead to cardiovascular issues in the first place.

Regular exercise, adequate sleep, sun exposure, and minimizing environmental toxins also contribute to optimal heart health in the long-term.

“Eat well, live well, think well” is Dr. Wolfson’s mantra.

Vance Voetberg

Author

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Marvellous stuff and thank you. Swimming and me don’t mesh but walking, yes, as much as I can. Part of a walking group, male only, and this does involve driving up to the National Park.

Friend circle coming out of the walking group, but also a female-majority Buddhist sitting group in a different town.

Welding would be funny. in my back yard there are several scorched bricks. Sobering.

Doing lots of very bad DIY but gradually, so I don’t hate it. Cats (two kittens now 7 months) are very engaging and putting a horrible first several weeks safely away for occasional reference only.

I will take the nice nurses phone call. Say it’s a bit sudden can I think about it. Do the reading. Take vitamin D.

Thanks again :pray:

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Will come back to this for more reflective read.

Thanks Evvy

Kieran

Thank you Evvy. I will reread and follow the links. The antiinflammatory effect is interesting but I will research old lore. Turmeric? I drink it and cook with it.

Asking to think about it is definitely what I will do.

On the subject of anti-inflammatories, there is a book (with the extract I said I’d copy) called Good Energy. On Rumble (I think) is a 2 hour Tucker Carlson interview withe the authors Calley and Casey Means. For anyone interested in health and especially in your situation, I’d say it would be a good investment of time.

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Hi folks, not sure whether this podcast has been mentioned but here it is if not:

I haven’t finished the 24 minutes yet - but so far, a lot of useful detail.

cheers

No!! Don’t take vitamin D, don’t take any supplements, don’t take any any advice from any fucker pushing a product, just eat high fat (plenty of meat - you know it makes sense, the fuckers want to stop us doing it) and low carbs (you know that makes sense too, the fuckers have been pushing it down our throats non-stop for ages, that’s why everyone’s so fat).

If you’ve any spare weight it will fall off in no time and you need not submit to any ‘blood pressure’ bollox ever again because you won’t have a problem.

I’d also be suspicious of advice from anyone who doesn’t want to tell you who they are even if I find myself agreeing with them some of the time. . .

And, for heaven’s sake, sugar is not a mistress or a master (unless you’ve given up on yourself of course, in which case you might as well take the statins along with the sugar and all the adverse events and conditions which follow). No, its just a poison. (We now taste sweetness in 100% black chocolate; no-one believes us when we tell 'em but its The Truth!)

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