Woah woah there good friend!
Let’s not rush to the finish line just yet 
What the data unequivocally show is that there was a large spike in deaths in 2020. To the extent that this has shifted the average life expectancy in England. What the death certificates record is that a large number of those deaths are or involve covid.
That’s all the actual data says. Everything else is analysis that requires some careful thought.
I’ll have a go at some careful thought soon. Promise!
Cheers
It’s not me that’s rushing…
https://www.theguardian.com › society › 2021 › sep › 15 › life-expectancy-in-england-falls-to-lowest-level-since-2011
15 Sept 2021Excess Covid deaths contributed to life expectancy in England falling by 1.3 years for men and 0.9 years for women Last modified on Wed 15 Sep 2021 18.42 EDT Excess deaths due to the coronavirus …
Life expectancy in England has fallen to its lowest level in nearly a decade, say health officials. Public Health England (PHE) said the drop of 1.3 years for men and 0.9 years for women was due …
A new report by Public Health England (PHE) has revealed that life expectancy has fallen by 1.3 years for males and 0.9 years for females. It is now 82.7 for women and 78.7 for men. It is now 82.7 …
https://www.independent.co.uk › news › health › coronavirus-life-expectancy-stats-b1819173.html
The average life expectancy at birth for men in 2020 dropped by 1.3 years and was down 0.9 years for women compared to 2019, the largest fall since 1939-40. Data published on Thursday by Public …
The COVID-19 pandemic reduced life expectancy in 2020 by the largest amount since World War Two, according to a study published on Monday by Oxford University, with the life expectancy of American …
COVID-19 pandemic cut life expectancy by years: Study. US males suffered the biggest drop in life expectancy of 2.2 years. The last time such large magnitudes of declines in life expectancy at birth were observed (in Western countries) in a single year was during World War II, the study found.
And that life expectancy was cut for men and women by 1.3 and 1.0 years respectively. Study author Dr Ridhi Kashyap said: 'As the nation reels from the shocking news that the number of deaths in the UK, for which Covid-19 is listed on the death certificate, has exceeded 100,000, our research provides further understanding of the tragic impact of the pandemic in England and Wales.
An estimated 62,750 excess deaths resulted in 2020 during the COVID-19 pandemic in England and Wales, according to demographic experts at Oxford’s Leverhulme Centre for Demographic Science - who reveal life expectancy was cut for men and women by -1.3 and -1.0 years respectively.
Yes that looks more like the Pali original PP. I chant this most days, often while cooking dinner. In a sense cooking a meal represents a belief that life will carry on for a while more, so it’s oddly apt that my mind surfaces this Recollection at the time.
… If it’s of some solace in your current predicament I’m honoured to be of some slight service.
But that’s a simple result of the number of deaths in 2020… That’s what the data says.
The reasons why there were so many deaths is a separate question
Shouting and repeating what is partly true and supports a political objective, while suppressing what is needed to complete the picture, and which would compete with the political objective - isn’t that usually recognized as propaganda!?
We all know the number of deaths - calling it a change in life expectancy, without defining or analysing life expectancy, is deceptive.
Look how all the media leapt on it! “They think it’s all been analysed!”
The ‘separate question’ is indeed being kept separate - safely hidden from view - while the population is nudged, cajoled and threatened to accept permanent life restricting changes as being necessary to protect their health and safety!
The more we ‘whoah’, the tighter will be the nooses
I’m not shouting my friend. Just thinking.
I wish that were true. There are folks even on this board who will deny that almost anyone died of covid…
The life expectancy is easily calculated by looking at the ages of those who died in a given year. When a lot of people died in a particular demographic, life expectancy changes. That’s not deceptive, it’s just the data.
Of course you are right about this. That’s one reason this site exists! I’m happy to continue having this discussion with you here.
We have to be careful about our conclusions. The data is known, but our conclusions are always up for re-analysis. Hence the woah… Feel free to re-apply it back to me whenever I need it!
Cheers ED. There is a lot more to be said… I"m sure we’ll get there!
Hey PP I didn’t mean you are shouting - but all the media were shouting, and your post shows all the medics will hear the shouting too.
We have to be careful that by being too careful defending propaganda as ‘factual’, we help along a process that is more dangerous than the virus.
And that process is proceeding with reckless abandon, hellbent on overcoming - crushing - all caution on the other side. So misplaced (sorry!) ‘caution’ in acknowledging the reality (EDIT: in acknowledging propaganda I mean - I don’t mean people should accept my vision of covid ‘reality’ ) just adds to the forces arraigned against those brave souls trying to resist.
No doubt the UK govt is waiting for a bit of a winter wave so as not to be blamed for introducing vaccine passports.
Here’s what our intelligentsia think, and it’s only autumn:
29/9/21 Unvaccinated Students at Bath University Told to Wear Different Colored Wristbands For Identification
So the ground for the next round of tightening is well laid!
Cheers
I said
Sorry, this isn’t quite right because you weren’t calling for a ‘whoah’ generally, just referring to the discussion. Whoah on my anti-whoah!
That’s twice you’ve said that. Who are you referring to?
Sorry PP but I just do not follow your logic!
As with all natural trends, an annual decline is never a straight line. If it was, then your argument would be correct. If your point was correct, then it seems to me there are 11 other years this century (apart from 2020), that require some explanation as they were actually better than 2020. How could this possibly be?
Yes… I feel like this happened the last time
It’s not a natural trend. It’s developments in healthcare, wellness and access to medicine. That has been steadily improving (until austerity…)
There are always moves above and below the line, but the trend continues. 2020 was the biggest reversal in the trend since the NHS was started.
Cheers
PP
I feel like they can identify themselves if they want to. Clues are in words like “scamdemic” and “fake pandemic” and other such terms. There are some who believe that viruses probably don’t exist at all, and that there is no such thing as a SARS-COV-2 virus.
Cheers
PP
EDIT: Here is an example of a thread that was arguing that 94% of covid deaths were just plain wrong. Either no one died, or they misdiagnosed practically all deaths.
I don’t say ‘scamdemic’ myself, because it makes it sound like I think there’s no virus.
But is there an aspect that does not have a significant element of deceipt?
Selling fake Rolexes or unnecessary roof repairs would be called a scam even though the watches or ‘repairs’ exist.
Maybe we need a Scam Scale - think of all the uses! 
Yes, scamdemic is different to manufactured pandemic or even “plandemic”. There is no doubt that there is a lot of deceit around, but…
People have actually got sick and actually died. In great numbers. That’s not a scam.
It’s still there, on the UK Government website, posted in March 2020:
As of 19 March 2020, COVID-19 is no longer considered to be a high consequence infectious disease (HCID) in the UK. There are many diseases which can cause serious illness which are not classified as HCIDs.
Please note that this is still shown as UK Government latest status.
There is a similar status report on the WHO website (they downgraded it from a pandemic in 2020), but I can’t be arsed finding a link to it at the moment, because these people are so evil/corrupt that I just can’t be bothered dealing with such scum.
And the obvious question I ask the hypnotised is: “how many covid funerals have you been to in the last 18 months?” or “how many people do you know that have got seriously ill with covid?”
The answer is always zilch, with a few fudged answers about people who died with covid but were on their last legs anyway.
For a laugh you can ask them about the cart that goes up and down their road each evening, collecting all the bodies of covid victims. Zilch. Nada.
God, the power of the media to brainwash people into believing something that is patently untrue.
But what is true is that since they started rolling out the jabs earlier this year (they are not vaccines, they are an experimental gene therapy that’s never been tried on humans before) very large numbers are getting seriously ill and/or dying.
Take it away, Nat…
I’m identifying myself!!
When you are able to find an isolate of “the virus” I’ll publicly say “I WAS WRONG”. But an isolate using the commonly understood meaning of that word, simply does not seem to exist.
An estimate; no, a guesstimate:
There’s a real pathogen about, maybe a virus if they really exist (undecided question, still), maybe engineered somewhat from a natural pathogen, maybe developed spontaneously by natural processes (also still an undecided question, though David Martin’s recent-patent revelations seem highly indicative). The pathogen, whatever it is, seems to be killing some people, as flu-pathogens do every season. This one may even be killing people outside the usual cold season, perhaps because of natural mutation, perhaps because of engineering. It’s total kill may be a bit higher than usual, though probably not by much. Also still undecided. But…
Despite today’s announcement of 'mass death from “covid” in the USA, there are no palpable piles of extra dead, as is required in any genuine pandemic. People continue to die daily, as life on Earth requires. Many of these deaths are coopted onto the alleged toll of the ‘covid’, falsely.
The 'pan’demic is in fact a sinister scam, built on the back of a slightly-nastier-than-usual flu-thing, the scam entirely worked up on lying terror propaganda, for deeply criminal purposes. This by a globalist clique of conspiring, fanatically anti-democratic gangsters - the sociopathic/psychopathic/WealthPowerStatus-addicted gics - as the worldwide lockstep response of those governments that have succumbed to their subversion - not all, apparently - makes clear: Buy and subvert the World Hoax Organisation; buy and subvert also the whole of Western lamestream media and their attendant cloud of captive whores, and as many purchasable/kompromatable pols in governments as possible, and launch the con from there…
Because of the upticked Permanent Bullshit Blizzard in which we’re presently engulfed, ALL information coming to us, from ALL sources, must be treated with extreme, provisional caution, especially statistics. There are zero one hundred percent trustworthy sources just now, because of the subversion being practiced by the PBB;
ZERO!
Canny common sense, gut feel (aka carefully-curated intuition) and careful reserve at all times are essential in dealing with any alleged ‘fact’ at all. A gambler’s feel for odds is essential. Keep scanning and sussing. There is a hierarchy of trustworthiness: some commentators are straight, some wholly crooked; lots are Deceived Influencers who have been conned by the continuous and very potent, mass-hypnotising fear–porn of the PBB into the role of useful idiots. Sussing who is which is essential, as well as one can.
No-one at all, anywhere, has the complete, certain picture.
The conspirators and their nod-and-wink fellow-traveller main-chance spivs have rushed out alleged ‘vaccines’ to - allegedly - ‘treat’ the alleged covid ‘pandemic’. Clearly these goops are criminally under-tested, and seem to have unadmitted extra purposes besides healing. They appear to be in any case unnecessary, ineffectual for stated purpose, and deadly dangerous. Natural immunity, following easily-treated, mostly mild encounters with the pathogen, appears to be the safest way to go. The alleged ‘vaccines’ should be avoided at all costs, up to and including armed resistance and - if unavoidable - civil war. Their potential dangers are too great for any lesser response to be adequate.
There also appear to be waves of euthanasist-style induced deaths going on sporadically, here and there, at the hands of double-thinking useful-idiot medics; all put down to the ‘pandemic’ of course - cf today’s announcement of near half a million deaths from ‘covid’ in the US. The scam should be treated as a sort of WW3 against the profoundly criminal conspirators behind it. Unfortunately, we, the common citizens, have been pitched into this war situation against our wishes. But here we are.
Nurnberg 2 should be got going as soon as maybe, to cleanse the stables. Above all, resist the fear-porn that pretends we’re in the grip of a global Black Death. We’re not. It’s a flu, easily treated for all but an unlucky few.
This is the current guesstimate of me, Rhisiart Gwilym; 2/10/21 
I think it causes problems and distress when people dismiss real deaths lightly.
But just to reiterate, as my analogy seems to have turned round in the wind - I didn’t go as far as to say it’s not a scam. It’s not unreasonable, as my analogy was meant to show. When there are so many scam elements I don’t think it’s reasonable to object to a simple reflective term, this is normal coinage. I don’t use it because I don’t want to appear to be doubting real deaths.
People are getting sick and dying because of offcial lies, especially about there being no treatment for early onset covid. Dreadful though it is for people to die, they shouldn’t be used to protect the lies that played a key role in their deaths.
It’s inevitable there will be a mix of experiences, feelings and attitudes but I think that’s a good reason to express one’s thoughts accurately (at least when it’s on personally sensitive matters) and not cause distress accidentally (or accidentally on purpose!). It would also save time and effort on recriminations!
Cheers
Such a lovely version of that song - thanks, Rob. I loved it. But… surely that’s Louis Armstrong?
Cheers
PP
